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Unread October 1st, 2007, 08:34 AM
TomJrzk TomJrzk is offline
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Dallas
Posts: 257
Default Re: Dawkins Speaks

Originally Posted by Fred H.
An atheist claiming spiritual values, claiming that he believes that human life is somehow unique, that it has inherent value, meaning, and purpose; and that there is some sort of objective truth, some sort of objective right and wrong, good and bad?

Well, I think most would realize that an atheist claiming spiritual values is about as laughable as Ahmadinejad claiming that Iran doesn’t punish homosexuals b/c, “In Iran, we don't have homosexuals.” I think that most would quickly see through Tom's transparent nonsense, and I doubt that he'd get many votes.
I think you already used that line. Can you come up with something more convincing?

You've already admitted that atheists are not necessarily nihilists, that some are actually nice people. How can that be? They can't possibly have any morals. So you have a major hole in your world-view that needs repairing. What are your thoughts on that?
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Unread October 1st, 2007, 10:13 AM
Fred H. Fred H. is offline
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 483
Default Re: Dawkins Speaks

Hey JimB, this one made me smile:
Dawkins rails at 'creationist front' for duping him into film role, Ewen MacAskill in Washington, Friday September 28, 2007, The Guardian,,00.html

Among the films being shown tonight at the Atheist Alliance convention taking place near Washington is, unsurprisingly, Monty Python's Life of Brian. What will not be showing are trailers for a new movie, Expelled.

Some of the world's best-known atheists, including British scientist Richard Dawkins, appear in the documentary, but they are unhappy with it. They say they agreed to appear in a documentary called Crossroads, but have ended up instead in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed.

They had expected Crossroads to be a debate about creationism versus Darwinism, but Expelled supports intelligent design (ID), a variation on creationism. The premise of Expelled is that scientists sympathetic to intelligent design are penalised by being denied academic posts.

The film, to have its premiere on February 12 in cinemas across the US, is fronted by Ben Stein, an actor and New York Times columnist. The timing may be linked to the 2008 presidential election, where creationism versus Darwinism often features in candidates' debates.

Professor Dawkins, who is speaking at the Atheist Alliance convention in Crystal City, Virginia, said in an email that had he known the film's premise he would not have agreed to take part. "At no time was I given the slightest clue that these people were a creationist front," he said. Other atheists said they were uneasy about the way they felt they had been duped.

Paul Zachary "PZ" Myers, a biology professor at the University of Minnesota and a leading critic of creationism, reproduced on Prof Dawkins' website a letter from Mark Mathis, a producer for Rampant Films. It says: "We are in production of the documentary film Crossroads: The Intersection of Science and Religion ... we are interested in asking you questions about the disconnect/controversy that exists in America between evolution, creationism and the intelligent design movement."

Professor Myers agreed to do the interview, but was surprised to see his name appear instead in what he described as "this new ID creationist movie" - Expelled.

Stein denied in the New York Times that he had misled anyone. "I don't remember a single person asking me what the movie was about," he said. The film company said the movie's title was changed on the advice of marketing experts.
I’ve always liked Ben Stein. Check out the site and trailer. Should be a great flick.

Last edited by Fred H.; October 1st, 2007 at 11:19 AM.
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