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  #1  
Unread January 8th, 2006, 01:08 PM
James Brody James Brody is offline
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Default Why Now? Vervets, Kids, & Toys

Dean Edell (WBAL, 1090 AM, about 4:30am today) announced that male African monkeys play with cars, females with pots and dolls. My web search found these data were published in Evolution & Human Behavior in 2002! I'm puzzled as to why now? But also delighted to find some data that I had missed in my preoccupations of 3 years ago. Wonder if the Harvard faculty knows of these things?
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See:
Http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...45_toys08.html
From 2005
"All too human? Monkeys mimic children in toy picks
"By Robert S. Boyd
"Knight Ridder Newspapers
"WASHINGTON ? Just like human boys and girls, male monkeys like to play with toy cars while female monkeys prefer dolls, a research project has shown... Like little boys, some male monkeys moved a toy car along the ground. Like little girls, female monkeys closely inspected a doll. Males also preferred balls while females fancied cooking pots. Both were equally interested in neutral objects such as a picture book and a stuffed dog."
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See also from 2002!:
http://www.innovations-report.com/ht...ort-15133.html
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See also:
http://psychology.tamu.edu/Fac_Ext.php?ID=127
Dr. Gerianne Alexander
Department of Psychology
Texas A&M University
College Station, TX 77843-4235

Office: 206 Psychology Building
email: gma@psyc.tamu.edu
Phone: (979) 845-2567
Fax: (979) 845-4727
Alexander, G. M. (2003). An evolutionary perspective of sex-typed toy preferences: pink, blue, and the brain. Archives of Sexual Behavior, 32., 7-17.
Alexander, G. M., & Hines, M. (2002). Sex differences in responses to children's toys in a non-human primate (Cercopithecus aethiops sabaeus). Evolution and Human Behavior, 23., 467-479.
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  #2  
Unread January 9th, 2006, 09:24 AM
Fred H. Fred H. is offline
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Default Re: Why Now? Vervets, Kids, & Toys

Quote:
. . . announced that male African monkeys play with cars, females with pots and dolls…. Wonder if the Harvard faculty knows of these things?
How disheartening, JimB, to see that culturally created sexist bias and socialization constructs pervade even monkey culture. I think the Harvard feminists need another $50 million kickback to study this crisis and implement recommendations promoting monkey egalitarianism—monkey children must be socialized to androgyny, and monkey parents must be more egalitarian in bringing up their offspring so that both boy and girl monkeys play with pots, dolls, and cars.
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  #3  
Unread January 11th, 2006, 01:19 PM
James Brody James Brody is offline
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Cool Re: Why Now? Vervets, Kids, & Toys

Fred,

Thanks for your insights...I'm thinking of kicking this item to Rush Limbaugh. Should be a sour pickle for him because he dislikes evolution but also dislikes feminism.

I notice also by your name that you retired your member. How is Shelly taking it?

Jim
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  #4  
Unread January 11th, 2006, 01:31 PM
James Brody James Brody is offline
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Wink Feminism...Eye Candy

RUSH: I'm probably going to get into a lot of trouble here, but there's a story. Six women have sued a German bank because they've been hired for "eye candy." They were hired as eye candy, which means they were hired for their looks. Maybe that's the stumbling block. Maybe... I have to think women know that term. So they got hired for their looks, and this offended them and so they filed these discrimination suits, $1.4 billion discrimination suit. All I know is... I know (sigh) I mean, I know some women who would love to be flattered, to be complimented to be hired as eye candy. So I ask the question: "How many of you women in the audience, in the deepest, dark secrets of your dreams and desires, would be flattered to be hired as eye candy?" I'm not talking about harassment. I don't know how many of you want to be sexually harassed. That's not what I was asking. But (sigh). I mean, if somebody wants to hire you to look good for whoever is the first to walk in the door every day, why not, if that's your asset?

"Well, that offends me. I would not. It's irrelevant the way I look."

Oh, really? Why do you spend so much time on it then?

"Well, it's not..."

It's the way the world is. Stuff matters, but (sigh). I just happen to think there are probably a lot of women out there that wouldn't be offended by it. I'm not talking about being chased around the desk but probably some women won't be bothered by that, either. Suzanne in Green Bay, you're next on the EIB Network. Welcome to the program.

EYE CANDY: Hi, Rush!

RUSH: Hi!

EYE CANDY: I'm not offended by your comment at all.

RUSH: Good! Good! A women of the nineties.

EYE CANDY: Yes. I've been doing appropriations for ten years, and it's a great part-time position.

RUSH: Wait, wait, wait. You have been doing promotions?

EYE CANDY: Yes, for companies that are promoting either liquor or MasterCard or Visas, hair products.

RUSH: Oh, you arrange promotional ideas for these people?

EYE CANDY: No, I actually work with the, um, customers so I go out into bars and I let people sample the products.

RUSH: You let people sample the product. So you are the eye candy?

EYE CANDY: I am the eye candy.

lots more at
http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/home/daily/site_011006/content/feminist_update.guest.html[/url]
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  #5  
Unread January 11th, 2006, 01:45 PM
James Brody James Brody is offline
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Default Re: Why Now about Vervets, Kids, & Toys

Dr. Anderson informed me that Scientific American triggered the Knight Ridder story and she hopes "this is the end of it.

She also liked Fred's remark.

She seems to be not only very smart but also very nice...

Jim B
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  #6  
Unread January 12th, 2006, 03:57 PM
alexandra_k alexandra_k is offline
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Default Re: Why Now? Vervets, Kids, & Toys

I think the little girl monkeys must be particularly smart to appreciate what a cooking pot is supposed to be used for...
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  #7  
Unread January 12th, 2006, 06:08 PM
Fred H. Fred H. is offline
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Default Re: Why Now? Vervets, Kids, & Toys

Quote:
JimB: I notice also by your name that you retired your member.
Jim: Must have been a typo. I corrected it.

Also, AK makes a good point regarding little girl monkey smarts—took me decades b/f I figured out the purpose of a cooking pot.
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  #8  
Unread January 12th, 2006, 07:00 PM
alexandra_k alexandra_k is offline
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Default Re: Why Now? Vervets, Kids, & Toys

Thanks for that. I'm just not sure how the girls 'knew' that a cooking pot was a 'girlie' thing... I've heard something about how monkeys may be socialised into gender roles by their mothers. I wonder if that could go some way towards accounting for the experimental findings. Not sure about this. Maybe girl monkeys are socialised into caring for young and things that could be used to carry water (maybe thats what had appeal about the cooking pot)?
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  #9  
Unread January 14th, 2006, 07:05 PM
James Brody James Brody is offline
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Default Basis for pots and cars?

Dr. Anderson also tinkers with the "why" in regard to cars and pots for guy and girl vervets.

An odd similarity: I sell multiple copies of very few pictures and all of them to women. The common element is that of a brighter center within a darker frame: that is, a dawn river framed by a black arch of the bridge across it. Another example: a shot of a stall door seen through a tunnel of two farm walls and the roof that connects them.

Females veer towards brighter objects? Perhaps a preference from Devonian eras when food may have been easier to locate near the water's surface.

Diamonds are a girl's best friend not only because they are costly but because they sparkle?

The force at a distance factor may bias the male preference for cars...

Mildly annoyed on this end because I can usually make up a story.

JimB
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