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Unread February 17th, 2006, 04:52 PM
Margaret McGhee Margaret McGhee is offline
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 271
Default Re: A Free Will Challenge

Fred: Actually Margaret, this ultimately boils down to only one essential issue: whether there is objective (mathematical) truth and whether we humans can consciously discern it and use it to understand the reality of the physical world and ourselves. And as I’ve noted elsewhere, the evidence that that is indeed the case is (IMO) overwhelming—and it’s the only way that we could ever “know” anything.
I believe there is objective truth, at least as far it exists for the purpose of defining the reality we inhabit - and that's a pretty important purpose. It all could be an illusion on some matephysical level but I'll leave those questions to Alexandra.

But our intellect is not the only way we can "know" anything. That is an illusion created by our intellect (conscious mind) on its own behalf. Long before we had intellect we had emotion and that is how we know most things - but sometimes our intellect adds another dimension to that "knowing".

Fred: But if you’re convinced otherwise, then so be it. However, in a world as you perceive it, all there can ever be are our illusions, our subjective constructs; and even if we happen to agree on something, like “BIG MEMES,” so what? It’d be nothing more than a consensus of our illusions, our subjective constructs.
You are putting beliefs into my mind to make your point. I have repeatedly stated that our intellectual conclusions are (sometimes very) objective views of reality that we have access to. So I am not saying that our subjective ways of knowing are all there is. I'm just saying that our sometimes imperfect objective views have to submit (by way of their emotional tags) to our decision-making process, like all our other inputs which may be stronger or not depending on the context.

I think your intellect which believes it has some open channel to the mind of God is offended that your emotions would have some ability to interfere with your (spiritually informed) decisions. So it has placed the concept of free will into your belief system and attached it there with strong emotions so that you will even put beliefs into other people's minds if that's what it takes to defend it.


Last edited by Margaret McGhee; February 17th, 2006 at 05:33 PM. Reason: Typo
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